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Oklahoma Voices
Oklahoma Voices 12/19/04[THUNDER AMBIENCE] SCOTT GURIAN: Let's face it. Meteorologists have a difficult job. We expect them to predict the future a week in advance with varying degrees of certainty. Then when they get it wrong we get angry. When they get it right, on the other hand, we're thrilled when they accurately predict a day of sunny skies with highs in the 70s and a light breeze from the North. But let's say they predict overcast skies with a steady drizzle and temperatures dropping into the 30s… well, let's just say the weatherman makes a convenient scapegoat. Coming up later this hour, we'll review last month's elections with the leaders of the state Democratic and Republican parties, and we'll speak to an author who's just written a comprehensive history of the state of Oklahoma. But first, we're gonna go on a bit of a radio field trip today to learn just what goes into forecasting the weather, and how technology is playing an important role in saving human lives. This is Oklahoma Voices. I'm Scott Gurian, and when I was growing up in the Northeast, I used to sit by my radio, listening intently to the weather report whenever the sky looked a little gray, the air was moist and the temperature dropped below say… 32 degrees. Sometimes I'd get lucky… ---[radio weather report]--- Now that kind of weather report would get my friends and I pretty excited, but that was nothing compared to what we were hoping to hear next… --[radio list of school closings]- That's right. We'd get a snow day, which meant we could sleep in for a few extra hours and have an extra day to study for that big test or complete our unfinished homework assignments. To us, the weather-man was a great, unsung hero to whom we owed a debt of gratitude. Now of course, that eventually changed. As I got older, snow meant I had to spend several hours shoveling, and since I worked in radio, the listeners were expecting to hear my broadcast no matter what. So when my car was snowed in during the giant blizzard in Washington, DC last year, I dug my winter boots out of the closet and spent a week walking several miles to work until the show eventually melted. Needless to say, my opinion of the weatherman had dropped considerably since my high school days. Now to be honest, it's actually pretty unfair. I mean, it's nice to give credit to the friendly people standing in front of the maps when they tell you what you want to hear, but it's not like they really have any control over what they're saying. And to blame them for forecasting anything less than mild temperatures and cloudless skies… well that's just shooting the messenger. Living in Oklahoma now, I have to say that I've once again grown quite appreciative of meteorologists for keeping me out of harm's way during all the severe weather we experience here. ---[television aircheck montage]--- The first thing I always notice during a severe storm is how much of a role computers and technology play in predicting the weather. I think it's pretty impressive that television forecasters can actually zoom way in on their maps to show where the tornados and thunderstorms are progressing, block by block. In fact, technology doesn't just play an important role in the background. It's very much at the center of the process. ---[Advantage Doppler HD montage]--- Yeah, that's right. Channel five claims bragging rights with its high-tech radar system that it says is the fastest in the world and nine times faster than all the other stations. We won't take sides in the battle, but suffice it to say that we're thankful KOCO allows us to re-broadcast its coverage during outbreaks of severe weather. In our daily weather updates, though, KGOU relies on the National Weather Service to bring you accurate, up-to-date information about what you should wear when you go outside or whether you should re-schedule that fishing trip you've been planning. Most residents of Central Oklahoma are aware of the existence of weather forecasting facilities near Max Westheimer Airport in Norman, but-beyond that-they have little idea what actually goes on there. So we're gonna spend the next half hour going behind the scenes at the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration's weather research and prediction facilities. Here's our tour guide. KELI TARP: My name is Keli Tarp. I'm the Public Affairs Specialist for NOAA in Norman. We're standing in the lobby of the building that houses the National Severe Storms Laboratory and the Storm Prediction Center. In a few minutes, I'll take you across the street to the National Weather Service Forecast Office and the Radar Operations Center. Our fifth organization, the Warning Decision Training Branch, is located in south Norman, so you won't be seeing that today. SCOTT GURIAN: She tells me to follow her as we pass the security desk and enter the building. KELI TARP: We can go up the hallway a little bit. And we have some displays along here that showcase some of the work being done at the National Severe Storms Laboratory. It's a research organization, federally funded laboratory, focused on knowledge about severe weather as well as the tools to predict severe weather. So the laboratory is focused on research, while the Storm Prediction Center in the same building is focused on forecasting. That's the main distinction. SCOTT GURIAN: Why do they track severe weather from here in Norman? KELI TARP: Well this map on the wall right behind me shows you one reason why we're located here. Research done by one of the National Severe Storms Laboratory scientists shows that we are the bulls eye for significant tornadoes in the United States. That means, climatologically, our past records show that a significant, an F2 or greater tornado occurs here in Central and Southern Oklahoma about every three years, which is greater than the rest of the United States. And it's because of our geographic location. We're the perfect place for this setup of the weather systems that create tornadoes; we have the warm, moist air coming up from the Gulf, and we have cool dry air coming over the Rocky Mountains, and they converge here over us, creating our severe weather. ---[tornado and thunderstorm ambience]--- SCOTT GURIAN: We go upstairs to meet with Jeff Kimpel, the Director of the National Severe Storms Laboratory. JEFF KIMPEL: We're not actually part of the National Weather Service. We're part of NOAA, the National Oceanographic and Atmospheric Administration. We are in the research arm of NOAA. We try to improve the scientific understanding, develops systems, observational systems, computer-based decisions, support systems that help the actual National Weather Service forecasters do their job better. SCOTT GURIAN: You say Severe Storms Lab. What kind of severe storms do you track? JEFF KIMPEL: Umm… think thunderstorms, hail, strong winds, tornadoes, heavy rainfall. We also do winter storms, heavy snow bands, ice storms, and lately we've been getting into interesting things like fire weather. SCOTT GURIAN: What kind of research is going on right now? Like what are the new things that they're developing, the new technologies? JEFF KIMPEL: Well, I can say that we're working, I think, in three very important areas. We are the people that did a lot of the research and development that led to the creation of a national network of Doppler weather radars, the so-called NEXRAD network. That system has a life cycle of 20 to 30 years, so we're already thinking about how that system will be upgraded or replaced. So we are now experimenting with some very new technology to the weather business called phase-to-ray weather radar technology, that electronically scans the atmosphere rather than the slow, old-fashioned way of scanning the atmosphere by mechanically rotating an antenna. We can do it much faster, we think we can do it with a lot more precision with this new technology. We're also using radar information along with every other piece of information we can get our hands on to develop very high resolution, very short-term computer-based forecast models, providing assistance on, given a storm, is it likely to produce a tornado? Yes? No? What we want to do is help the Weather Service extend the lead-time of tornado warnings from the present ten or thirteen minutes out to 45 minutes. We think this will give people more time to take an appropriate response, get in the proper location, move the car into the garage, make sure that their children and relatives are in a safe place before the storm actually hits, so we think that's very important. The third area is that we're working again with radar-based rainfall analyses. And we think that having national coverage from the radar network of how hard it's raining, where, updates of rainfall amounts every five minutes would be very important in initializing the models that would do a better job of predicting flash floods. Also providing information into longer-term flooding, water management activities. We think there's a real value in doing that. Freshwater is getting to be a very important commodity globally, and we think that things we can do to help conserve water, help use it more effectively is going to be important in the future. SCOTT GURIAN: I was going to ask what you thought the future held in store for the predicting of severe storms, how this new technology will sort of change the way that you forecast. JEFF KIMPEL: Well, there are always new technologies, I mean there are things that you can't really anticipate. For example, the development and the rapid expansion of the Internet and the ability to move huge volumes of information very quickly around the world. But a lot of meteorology has developed from technologies that were developed for another purpose. I think radar is a perfect example. I mean it was designed to track very fast moving aircraft and missiles. We have the old antenna out the back window here that used to be up on the DEW Line on the Arctic Circle looking for missiles being launched over the North Pole during the Cold War. And we re-engineered that system to track very slow-moving, very large, soft weather systems. Satellite imagery is another relatively new thing, and then of course the whole advances in solid state technology with computers has just revolutionized the way we do weather forecasting. A lot of it is computer-based, machine-based forecasting techniques, which frees up the human forecaster to spend time thinking and making critical decisions, being able to devote their time to do that rather than analyzing maps and charts like we used to do 30 years ago. If you really think about it, modern meteorology wasn't even possible until the invention of the telegraph because you have to have information, and you could not assemble information from a wide geographical area in one spot to even plot a map until the telegraph had been invented. So we're constantly looking at what new technologies, new scientific ideas have that we can then incorporate into our meteorological activities tp help improve the forecasts, with the goal of eventually saving lives and protecting property. It's a very exciting business. I mean in Norman, Oklahoma, between the NOAA organizations and the university has about 700 people working on meteorological problems, meteorological forecasting, meteorological education programs, and it's unique in the country, if not the world. ---[MUSIC: Tornado Coming to Your Town by John Fausett]--- SCOTT GURIAN: Jeff Kimpel is the Director of the National Severe Storms Laboratory. ---[MUSIC: Tornado Coming to Your Town by John Fausett]--- SCOTT GURIAN: Let's re-join our tour guide, Keli Tarp, and continue on our journey. KELI TARP: The Storm Prediction Center actually used to be in Kansas City. And they were in Kansas City from the '50s because that was where the telegraph lines met, actually. And so that was the best way to get their products out to the public, and people from this precursor to the Storm Prediction Center would come to Norman to do research in the springtime, because the storms were here and also because the facility's were here for them to be based out of: the airport and the former Navy base. And so then when the Severe Storms Laboratory was formed, it was a logical place to put it here in Norman. And then in 1997, the Storm Prediction Center moved to Norman to be co-located with the Severe Storms Laboratory once again, so they could benefit from collaboration between scientists and forecasters. SCOTT GURIAN: The Storm Prediction Center's Director Joe Schaefer meets us in a hallway, next to a large, glass window. JOE SCHAEFER: We're standing in front of the Storm Prediction Center operations area, and what we're looking at is the workstations that the forecasters use to provide a 24-by-seven continuous weather watch across the lower 48 states, looking for small-scale development of hazardous weather. When we anticipate something is about to happen, we put out forecasts and advisories accordingly. Then if the storms actually develop, the warnings come out of the local forecast offices. SCOTT GURIAN: So you look at the predictions sort of before the storm materializes, and you also sort of look at the broader view across the country, as opposed to just regional that each of the offices would look at? JOE SCHAEFER: Very well stated. Yeah, that's exactly what we do. SCOTT GURIAN: Can you point out maybe some of the particular computers and tools that you use in this office? JOE SCHAEFER: Yeah, what we do is we monitor the weather across the country. For the technical folks, I just had a guy tell me today that we're now ingesting an average of 160 gigabytes of data coming in here every day. We have our own satellite dishes that we get the satellite picture from the NOAA satellites, the two of them: one looking at the eastern 2/3 of the country, and when looking at the western 2/3 of the country. We get lightning data in real-time that shows where strokes occur. These computers also process dispersion-type forecasts, where we say where the air is going to be going, so that if someone releases a hazardous chemical, these computer models will give an idea of where the plume will go with time, so it becomes a very serious homeland security issue. We get numerical models, and when you run a numerical model, you have a grid covering the country, much like a screen wire, and we get every data point on these models, which is thousands of data points every five minutes. And we get all this data in that we can look at. So we bring all the data in and we have a nest of computers. We process the data aimed for the forecaster. You know, what kinds of data the forecaster looks at. We process it, present it to them so that it's in a format they understand. The computers are interactive, so that if you're looking at the computer and there's an area, say northeast Kansas, that's of importance, we can move the cursor right over it, move the mouse over it, hit a button and we can explore in detail what's happening in that area, so we get the three-dimensional picture of the weather at that spot. --[MUSIC: Deadly Beauty by John Fausett]--- KELI TARP: In this building is the Radar Operations Center. You can see a model of the NEXRAD radar right here that shows the antenna and the raydome and the pedestal. The Radar Operations Center is responsible for support and maintenance and upgrades to the NEXRAD radar system that is used across the nation and around the world, a total of 168 radars. And over here is a map of the locations of the radars. This was technology developed in Norman, and then once the Weather Service adopted it, they needed an organization to oversee this sophisticated piece of equipment, and so that's why the Radar Operations Center was created. You can see on this map: the yellow circles are National Weather Service radars, the blue circles are military radars, and the red circles are FAA radars. It's all the same radar, it's just different users, and the Radar Operations Center supports all of those. As you walk along the halls here, you see the different radar images showing unique features. You see pictures of people actually painting the outside cover of the radar, the raydome. SCOTT GURIAN: So it's those giant orbs that people see? KELI TARP: Right. The radar is unique because-- not only can you see weather, but sometimes you can see birds and actually bats coming out. SCOTT GURIAN: So it's a very precise… KELI TARP: It's very precise SCOTT GURIAN: So how far away does the radar reach? KELI TARP: The radar reaches about 200 miles, maybe sometimes a little more. Of course the Earth curbs, and so as you go further away from the radar, the radar beam actually goes further up in the atmosphere. This is the Radar Operations Center hotline, and on one side of the room we have meteorologists, the other side of the room technicians. They provide 24 hour support for the radar around the world. So they are truly experts when it comes to keeping the radar running. It's a very complicated piece of equipment. Most of the time it does work, but every once in a while it does break down, and so if the local folks can't fix it, they call here for help, for technical assistance. SCOTT GURIAN: So it's a worldwide hot line number that people call in? KELI TARP: It's actually a worldwide hotline number that people call for help, and they solve most of their problems the first time somebody calls. If it is extra complicated, then we have sent out people to the radar site to do the work themselves. SCOTT GURIAN: Finally we arrive at the last stop on our tour, the National Weather Service's Norman Forecast Office. I'm introduced to Mike Foster, who bears the title of "Meteorologist in Charge," lest there be any confusion about who's the boss. MIKE FOSTER: Well this is the Forecast Operations Area, and we have the responsibility for all of the weather forecasts, advisories, warnings for severe weather, tornadoes, flash floods, river flooding for all of Western and Central Oklahoma and eight counties in Western North Texas including Wichita Falls. We maintain an around-the-clock weather watch, and in fact we are a 24/7 activity. All around the room, if you look, we have eight forecasting workstations. Not all of them our full all the time. It depends upon whether we are in severe weather operations. Most of the time of the year everybody knows the weather is relatively benign, it's not a real big problem. And during those times, we have two forecasters who work on around the clock. But then there coming those days, and everybody in Central Oklahoma is familiar with those, where the weather suddenly turns extreme, and we can be faced with the potential for multiple violent tornadoes ripping through the communities of Central Oklahoma. On the days that those kinds of events become apparent, we can increase by five-fold the number of people that may be working in here in order to deal with that situation. What's available on these workstations are data that is coming into us right now that shows us, for instance in satellite imagery or radar imagery or observations taken at the surface. The computers provide information about what's happening now, but then the human forecaster and then the human judgment are used working with those things that show up on these banks of computers to make the actual forecast or the actual warning decision, in fact. SCOTT GURIAN: So you don't foresee computers and technology ever completely replacing the human forecaster? MIKE FOSTER: Well, no. I don't see it ever completely changing or eliminating the human forecaster, but I see those roles changing over the years. As more and more computers become available with more and more memory and more and more processor speed, as scientific research goes on and continues to understand the behavior of the atmosphere, the accuracy of the computer models sort of steadily increases and moves along. So the ability of the computer to do forecasting, say for the middle of next week, might become better than the men, but it will be a long, long, long time before the ability of the computer to make an accurate description about what might happen in the next 30 minutes with a given thunderstorm that may or may not produce a tornado. The closer it is in time, the more dangerous it might be to human life and property, the more important it is that the expert human forecaster is involved in the process. SCOTT GURIAN: How long have you been a weather forecaster? MIKE FOSTER: I have been one since… 25 years now. SCOTT GURIAN: And how has technology and computers changed your work overtime? MIKE FOSTER: That's pretty incredible. My first experience with the Weather Service was the forecasts were typed up on specially-modified, old typewriter that-- instead of showing letters on a sheet of paper-- would type out a spool of teletype tape and get broadcast across a real slow teletype network. And there were almost no color images at all, there were no real computer screens at the time that this was all going on. It was all done with teletypes and fax machines. The amount of technology increase has been tremendous over the years, and a lot of it-- the most important parts of it-- were developed right here in Norman, Oklahoma. The most significant, single increase in the ability of the Weather Service to provide accurate and timely warnings to help people save their lives, are owing to the radar system, and the precursor of that radar was developed right across the street here. The first one that was used in testing within the Weather Service was tested in this office, and all that grew out of the synergy that exists here on this campus with the Storm Prediction Center, the National Severe Storms Laboratory, the Weather Forecast Office here, the School of Meteorology at OU and the interaction that takes place between all those people where ideas develop, and they get a chance to be put into place and practiced in the real, operational world. It's all a very important community and does a great deal of the technology development and the improvement in forecasts and warnings that have occurred over the years. SCOTT GURIAN: Michael Foster is the Meteorologist in Charge at the National Weather Service's Norman Forecast Office. Thanks also to NOAA Public Affairs Specialist Keli Tarp, who served as our tour guide on the radio today. ---[MUSIC: One Team by John Fausett]--- SCOTT GURIAN: All of the weather center organizations are looking forward to re-locating to the new, National Weather Center Building on the University of Oklahoma's South Research Campus. The 65 million dollar facility is scheduled to open in early 2006. We'll have more on that in future shows. Oh, and in case you were wondering, the guy singing in the background is Warning Coordination Meteorologist John Fausett of the National Weather Service's El Paso-area forecast office. You can find a link to his songs and lyrics on our website, http://www.kgou.org. ---[MUSIC: One Team by John Fausett]--- ----------------- SCOTT GURIAN: This is Oklahoma Voices. I'm Scott Gurian. Democrats across the country are slowly re-grouping after last month's elections, where Republicans stayed in control of the Presidency and gained ground in both the House and the Senate. National Democratic Committee Chairman Terry McAuliffe has sent an e-mail to supporters, asking them to complete an online survey to help determine the party's next steps. Democrats are also doing a lot of soul-searching here in Oklahoma, where voters elected Republican Tom Coburn to the US Senate and gave Republicans control of the state House for the first time in 80 years. Now that a month has passed, and state politicians have had some time to do some reflection, we decided to pay a visit to the state Republican and Democratic party headquarters. In a few moments, we'll ask state Republican party Chairman Gary Jones to share his thoughts on the election, but first, we'll check in with state Democratic party Chair Jay Parmley. I asked him to begin by describing why he thought Democrats suffered such setbacks on November 2nd. JAY PARMLEY: Well, I think several things have contributed to the outcome on Election Day. One, I mean, we knew George Bush got 60% of the vote here four years ago. This was clearly not a state that the Democrats ever thought was in play nationally, and we knew that to win the Senate, or to keep the House, we had to split votes. People had to vote for George Bush, or were going to vote for George Bush for President, and we had to convince them to vote for Brad Carson and for legislators. So that was always our task. Two things happened. On Election Day, 43% of everyone that voted, voted straight-ticket. Astronomical number in my opinion. Of that, roughly 370,000 people voted straight-ticket Republican and 297,000 voted straight-ticket Democratic. So it reinforces our first point: that we have to pull votes off of George Bush. Secondly, I think that the Republicans did a good job of nationalizing the Senate election, and they played into Bush's campaign, which was really a lot based on fear. And I think morality, but fear and morality closely related, and values. And they emblazoned-- I think in people's minds-that if Democrats were in power, terrorism would be rampant and that your traditional values would be gone. And I think in the end, even though we spend more money than we've ever spent, we mobilized more people than we ever mobilized, it wasn't enough. So I think now we have to really go back to the basics and define our message and convince people that there's a difference between the two parties. SCOTT GURIAN: I think that's what I'm trying to get at. I mean, speak about what you see as the Democratic Party's role in Oklahoma. I mean this part of the country is generally thought of as fairly conservative, so how do you see the Democratic Party fitting in? JAY PARMLEY: Well, it's about issues. It isn't about conservative versus liberal. You know, if the Republicans want to talk about workers comp reform or even tort reform is their great issue of the day, I want to know why our teachers are paid 50th in the country. I want to know why children go to bed hungry. I want to know why women aren't paid as much as men. I want to know why we aren't recruiting more industry to the state to create the kinds of jobs that people can raise a family on. I think those issues are very striking, and the Republicans don't seem to care a lot about those issues. They seem to think worker's comp and tort reform will solve everything. SCOTT GURIAN: It seems like Oklahoma Democrats would split from the National Party. Even just looking at the recent, you know, Senate campaign. I mean this is a brochure from Brad Carson saying he stood up against his own party to oppose partial birth abortions and same-sex marriage. When Carson and Coburn debated on-what was it?-"Meet the Press" on NBC, it was written about in the Washington Post. The first line was, "At times it was hard to tell who was the Democrat and who was the Republican." JAY PARMLEY: Yeah, that's true. But here's the bottom line. I mean, I think the beauty of the national party and the platform is that it gives us a lot of flexibility, and the Republicans, I think, have effectively convinced people that, you know, the National Democratic Party is a bunch of liberal elitists from the Northeast and the West Coast. And, you know, there is a little truth to that. But where the party is probably very-nationally-- much very pro-choice, the Oklahoma Democratic Party is a lot more accepting and tolerant of pro-life stances. Nowhere do we as Oklahoma Democrats say that we support gay marriage-or that we support civil unions for that matter. We believe we should foster an open and tolerant society, and that's a very different message than being pro gay rights. When it comes to guns, you know, our national party is just unequivocally, usually for gun control, but our party in Oklahoma takes great pains to announce our allegiance to gun owners and to hunters. So, I mean, there's some nuanced things, but I don't think it… You know, I think the basic philosophy we fit into nicely, and that is: people are important, government does have a legitimate role in our society and should be viewed as a positive force, not a negative force, and that in the end, individual liberties and civil rights and treating people with respect is pretty important. And as long as you can agree to these three or four general philosophies, then these nuances don't make you a better Democrat or less of a Democrat. That's just the way it is. SCOTT GURIAN: When you speak about the nuances here in Oklahoma, I'm sure it's a constant balancing acts. Do you ever risk, you know, possibly alienating more progressive voters? JAY PARMLEY: Yes. Absolutely. I hear the phrase a lot, "Well they have nowhere else to go, so they'll be with us." I think that's very dangerous. I think when you start doing that, and I try very hard not to do the, but I think when you start doing that, you can risk alienating. And I think the only thing that has kept our progressives in this state in our party is the fact that our ballot access laws are so restrictive, that if the Green Party were here or an alternative party were here, we would lose more progressive votes. So is a constant balancing act, but it's one our party has always had. We're a much larger tent, we have more diverse views, and we're kind of used to it, but you do always run the risk of losing people on your extremes. Both parties do. But you shouldn't run… Just like we shouldn't run from the far Right, we should be running from the far Left. These progressive arguments are critical, and sometime the right solution. So to write-off the progressives altogether is very dangerous because-- while I do not identify with the far Right, I would never want them to disappear, because it's a check and balance system in our line of thinking. I want to know what they're thinking. I want to know where progressives are thinking. I may not campaign on those issues each time, but at least I know where the balance is. In the end, elections are won in the middle. You take whatever 40% in the middle or 20% in the middle or whatever it is and you start adding that 20% each side, and that's how you get your majority. And for the far Right to dismiss the far Left is unacceptable in a Democratic society, and for the far Left to dismiss the far Right is equally unacceptable. SCOTT GURIAN: So where does the Democratic Party go from here? I mean, given the recent election results, it seems like you are not, sort of, I guess doing a good enough job reaching out to voters on the other side of the political spectrum. JAY PARMLEY: Well, I think what we go do and we're starting to do is we're going to spend a lot of time talking to our Democrats at first. Try to focus on really why people are Democrats, and then from that take it to a three-point message and really draw a line and say, you know, "These are our values-When I see values, I don't mean values as in morals-these are things we believe in, this is what makes us Democrats, and this is what we're not willing to compromise on." And if we continue to lose, that's OK. You know, it's OK in that we have a message, we have a definition. We have a way to bring people to our side because we'll eventually win. We'll eventually draw enough of a contrast. We'll eventually bring enough people to that side because we'll stand up and say what we believe. So that's where we go. And it's better to know what you believe in than it is to just rack up another when. A win is important. I mean, I want to win, and that's the goal, but sometimes you have to step back and say, How do we get to that win? And it may take another loss somewhere along the line to do that. It's essentially… both sides go through that, but we should not be afraid to lose. You go out there to win, but you should not be afraid to lose, and we should know why. And I think we've learned that from this election. It's been spoken clearly. And some people say, you know, Mike Turpin, our former Attorney General always says, "You can't fall out of a ditch." Meaning, we lost the Senate election, we lost some seats in the House and two seats in the Senate, and-can it get worse? Theoretically, I guess it could. But, you know, we use this as sort of the bar, the ditch, and say, How do we start climbing out? Because you can't do worse. That's what I mean is that we focus ourselves with our message, crafting that message where people feel comfortable in drawing the line between Democrats and Republicans. I think the line is blurred in most, in a lot of people's minds. And if we can un-blur the line, then I think we'll be better off. SCOTT GURIAN: That was Oklahoma Democratic Party Chairman Jay Parmley. After I spoke with him, I walked across the street to the Republican Party headquarters to talk with chairman Gary Jones. I started off by asking him how the Republicans had made such significant gains in the election. GARY JONES: We put together a good game plan. We worked on getting people registered to vote. We set a goal of 50,000 new registered voters, I think we ended up with 92,000. We had good candidates. Someone asked me, they said, "When did you first think that you would actually take over the House of Representatives?" I said at 5:00 on Wednesday of filing. Because we knew who our people were, we knew who theirs were, and it was match-play, and we matched up extremely well, and then when it came time, we got our people out to vote. SCOTT GURIAN: Talk a bit about the political climate here in Oklahoma. I mean, it's generally characterized as fairly conservative compared to other parts of the country. And I guess, not just Oklahoma, but this whole sort of part of the middle of the country. Well, first of all, would you agree with that characterization, and what role do you see Republican and Democratic Party politics playing in Oklahoma versus in other places? GARY JONES: It is definitely a conservative state, and the way that Democrats have held onto power in Oklahoma so long is the fact that they have held control of the rural areas. Most states, the rural areas are Republican. They've held the Court Houses, they've done a good job in the past of convincing the people out in the rural areas that they care about them. You know, what you are finding is the gains we're making are significantly more in the rural areas than anywhere else. Of the ten seats we gained in the Oklahoma House-we won ten and lost one as far as pickups-nine of those ten were outside of the Tulsa or Oklahoma City metropolitan areas. SCOTT GURIAN: Well, I mean, looking at you are opponents, it seems like many of the Oklahoma Democrats break with the national Party on issues, you know, social issues like abortion, gay rights, Second Amendment rights and so forth. So it appears as though they're taking more conservative stances than Democrats in a lot of other places would. I mean, that doesn't mean that there still aren't differences between the Republican and Democratic Party in Oklahoma, because I think people like yourself would say there certainly are. But, do you see that sort of encroachment from their side on your stances? GARY JONES: Well I think one thing you've got to look at, especially in the national races… Whenever you send somebody up there to represent you, they're going up there and they become part of a body that does not represent the state. Like the National Democrats do not represent Oklahoma. I think that we drove that message home real well in the fact that if you sent Brad Carson up there, it could mean a shift in power. You know, Brad Carson is not a dumb guy. He's a very intelligent man, so what he did was he went out there to look to see what he believes people wanted to hear, and he became everything he thought they wanted to hear. The problem was he dodged the question over and over and over again about who he supported for president. Finally he said, Oh, I support Kerry. And they said, well why would you support Kerry when two-thirds of Oklahoma's supported Bush? And he said, "Well because I'm a Democrat." And that defined it right there. And I think that we drove that message home. It's the fact that he comes in and says one thing, but when he goes back to Washington, he's going to be supporting the Democrats, and Washington Democrats are not like Oklahoma Democrats. SCOTT GURIAN: So regardless of whether Democrats actually follow through on their stances on a variety of what might be referred to as more conservative issues… Just the fact that they're claiming to hold those stances, I guess, is that sort of a fact of life of doing business in Oklahoma? Do they sort of have to take their stances in order to get elected, and is that a testament to the strength of the Republican Party? GARY JONES: Basically what they've been trying to do for years now, is they've been trying… you look at their platform, and it's, like, "Oh we're not really Democrats, where really Republican, but it's OK in Oklahoma." Everybody in Oklahoma that's running says they're a conservative. But you get Cal Hobson up at the Capitol who's now in control of the Oklahoma Senate. And he'll tell you that he is one of the most liberal politicians in the state of Oklahoma. And he's the person that they elected to be their representative. They didn't elect a conservative Democrat, they didn't elect somebody that's in tune with the people out there. They elected the most liberal. SCOTT GURIAN: The question is, though, when you look at things in perspective… I mean, you talk about the "most liberal politician in Oklahoma." Could that be conservative on a national scale? GARY JONES: Well, I think that… SCOTT GURIAN: Or centrist… GARY JONES: Well definitely. I mean, I've been to the Republican National Committee meetings, and I can tell you that the people from the Northeast are a lot more liberal, even the Republicans are more liberal than we are in Oklahoma. And one of the best things that happened to Republicans was when the Democrats all came to Stillwater running for President. And you heard what they… you know, Jay Parmley told them, he said, "This is a conservative state. Put your most conservative hat on." And then you heard what they had to say, and Democrats were telling me, they said, you know, "I don't have anything in common with these people." They said, "If these are the people that I have to choose from…" in fact, what was amazing to me, was that when a poll was taken of all the Democrats going into the Democratic primary for President in Oklahoma, the person that got more votes than anybody, cause they gave them a choice… more Democrats were willing to vote for Bush than they were for any of the Democrats that they put on that slate. And then subsequently, it proved out. SCOTT GURIAN: So you'd say the Democratic Party, looking ahead now, faces an uphill battle in Oklahoma? GARY JONES: I think that what you'll find is, I think that people are starting to look now and say, Who represents me? And, you know, there was a pamphlet that was put out years ago that said "Grandpa was a Democrat." And if their grandfather looked to see what Democrats stand for today and what Republicans stand for today, there'd be no choice. They'd be Republican. SCOTT GURIAN: Gary Jones is the chairman of the Oklahoma Republican Party. ---[MUSIC: What Did You Do on Election Day? By The Foremen]--- ---------------- SCOTT GURIAN: When you work at a radio station, lots of publicists and authors send you copies of their books. Here in front of me, I'm looking at The Savvy Senior, here's a book about Pakistani politics and The Old Farmers' Almanac. And then here's one of the more interesting ones that was mailed to our station recently. It's a little heavier than the rest, and looks part textbook, part coffee table book. It's called Oklahoma, A Rich Heritage: An Illustrated History. KGOU's Susan Shannon says this is a classic case of why you shouldn't judge a book by its cover. SUSAN SHANNON: You may be asking yourself, "Why another book on Oklahoma history?" and indeed that's what I asked myself, but from the moment I opened this book, I was hooked, not just on the writing, but on the more than 400 photographs, drawings and depictions of historical figures that are important in both Oklahoma history and in the larger history of the United States. As Director of Research for the Oklahoma Historical Society, co-author William Welge is in the unique position of having unlimited access to much of the state's most precious memorabilia. When I spoke with him, he said his intimate familiarity with the state's history also comes from his experience of living here most of his life… WILLIAM WELGE: I'm originally from San Antonio Texas, but have lived in Oklahoma since 1966, and so better than 2/3 of my life has been spent in Oklahoma, and I feel very much more an Oklahoman than I do a Texan these days. I went to the University of Oklahoma, got my Bachelor's degree in broadcast journalism, joined the staff of the Oklahoma Historical Society in 1977, and rose through the ranks, and became the Director of the Research Division. Working in the archives portion of the Historical Society for many years, you're steeped in our history. And I had always had an interest in wanting to further the promotion of Oklahoma history. And when I was approached by the publisher American Historical Press earlier this year if I would be interested in helping update to the current period our state history, I leaped at the chance, because this was something I really wanted to do. And since I did have a background in journalism and have written a number of articles on a variety of historical topics over the years, this would give me an opportunity to actually have a published work to my name, so that was exciting. And so I spent quite a few months culling various resources, collecting oral interviews with individuals pertinent to various important topics, especially of areas that took place in the last 25 years that Oklahoma's history was a big roller coaster ride for most of those years. Especially during the 1980's, when we had our oil and gas industry and agriculture kind of take a nose dive in the early 1980's after doing so well throughout most of the 1970's. Then the banking issues that occurred with all the bank closures and county commissioners scandals and a whole series of things during the 1980's was somewhat traumatic for the people. But there were some bright moments too. I mean, we started our centennial for the unassigned lands region that includes Central Oklahoma occur in 1989. We had the passage of House bill 1017 under Governor Bellmon's second administration in late 1989. That revolutionized education opportunities for-not only the students-but for teachers as well throughout Oklahoma. So that was a very significant milestone in our history. SUSAN SHANNON: What I really enjoyed as an Oklahoma Indian was the, you know, at the beginning of the book, talking about the different tribes. And I mean, you started off from like, I believe the 15, 1600's talking about the tribes? WILLIAM WELGE: Well, it starts off in 1535, with Coronado being appointed as a region in the New World. And he, by 1541, had been intrigued by rumors that had been circulating about cities of gold in the New World. And so he assembled a large contingent of troops and Indian guides to take him into the main interior wish they had never really explored before. And so that took him into, eventually Oklahoma and into Kansas looking for this seven cities of gold or Cebolla as they called it. And throughout our history, the Native Americans have played a pivotal role in so many ways, not only three tribes being indigenous to the state: Caddo, Wichita and the Osage, but then, of course, during the bulk of the nineteenth century, beginning in 1831 and concluding in 1886 with 64 tribes being forcibly removed and relocated to Indian territory from all over the United States. And so our history is so closely tied to the various Indian tribes of Oklahoma it would be remiss if we didn't emphasize that. SUSAN SHANNON: You know what I liked about it also besides, of course, your writing, was the pictures and the paintings… I mean, there was a lot of pictures. Where did you have to go for all of those? WILLIAM WELGE: Well, a variety of sources. The University of Oklahoma's Western History Collection provided images. The Oklahoma Historical Society provided images. A number of talented photographers-Jim Argo and Terry Zinn presented images included in the book. The Oklahoma Department of Tourism. And I also, in my travels crisscrossing the state, would stop and find things of interest that I thought would be appropriate for inclusion in the book, and so I would photograph some things myself. So I am very pleased that the work included so many, a variety of images, black and white and color. There's a lot of color images that you don't ordinarily see in most history books. SUSAN SHANNON: Would you say this book is becoming like a textbook for high school students? WILLIAM WELGE: Uh…It is our hope. The publisher is hoping to present this to the Oklahoma Textbook Commission for inclusion into the secondary school system, and a subsequent teacher's guide would be then produced to assist the educators with the presentation of the book, the history. SUSAN SHANNON: That would be excellent. Cause I know there are so many non-Indian kids that are, you know, living in the small towns, and they don't even know the name of the tribe that resides there. WILLIAM WELGE: Well, that's so true. And it's quite unfortunate that, in general, Oklahoma history… they only get to a certain point, you only get nine weeks of it, and you never really get beyond 1907 in many ways. And of course here we are fast-approaching our centennial of statehood in 2007, and the 20th century largely gets ignored when teaching it in the classroom. SUSAN SHANNON: I think a lot of people would say, Why? Why another book on Oklahoma history? Do you have an answer for them? WILLIAM WELGE: Well, I think our history is so rich and diverse the there's always new information that comes to the forefront with each succeeding generation. Just when you think just about everything could possibly been written about our state history, we find new records that come available through private hands that were held for so long, and it provides a new light on, or sheds new light on an interesting aspect of our history. And so I think that this is really the first book of the new century, the 21st century, that brings it up to the current period, up to 2004, and with the intent of our looking towards this centennial in 2007. So it needed to be done, there hasn't been an updated history of our state for some years, so it's something that I think was ready to be accomplished. ---[MUSIC: Oklahoma soundtrack]--- SUSAN SHANNON: William Welge is co-author with Odie Faulk of the book Oklahoma, A Rich Heritage: An Illustrated History, which is published by the American Historical Press. This book is chock full of the little-known and forgotten facts, taking us from Indian Territory to present-day Oklahoma, a kind of "how we got here from there" story. It's all in there, the good and the bad, the colorful and the criminal, updating the singularly unique history of the 46th state. For Oklahoma Voices, I'm Susan Shannon. ---------------- SCOTT GURIAN: You've been listening to "Oklahoma Voices," a public affairs presentation of KGOU public radio. The views and opinions we've been expressing this past hour are not necessarily those of the staff or management of KGOU or the University of Oklahoma. The clips of weather reports we played at the beginning of this show came to us courtesy of W-I-N-S radio and television stations KOCO, KFOR and KWTV. We'd love to hear your feedback on this and all local KGOU news and public affairs programming. Please write to us at news@kgou.org. And check out our website at kgou.org to find a transcript of today's show and links for more info on today's guests. I'm Scott Gurian. Thanks for listening. [MUSIC SLOWLY FADES OUT] |