TRANSCRIPT
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Dick Pryor: This is Capitol Insider - taking you inside politics, policy, and government in Oklahoma. I'm Dick Pryor with Quorum Call publisher Shawn Ashley. Our special guest is the Governor of the State of Oklahoma, Kevin Stitt. Thanks for joining us, Governor.
Governor Kevin Stitt: Hey, thanks so much. It's great to be back with you guys and talk about my last State of the State.
Shawn Ashley: And before we do that, let's talk about – you’re chair of the National Governors Association, only the second Oklahoma governor to hold that position. As you work with the other governors, what are the top two or three common issues governors across the U.S. are concerned about right now?
Governor Kevin Stitt: The topic of the day is immigration reform. And governors know that they want the best economies in their state. And so, I think there's from our perspective, there's a bipartisan agreement that we need to control workforce permits at the state level because the feds just seem to screw everything up and they're playing politics all the time. And we're overcomplicating this. I mean, we all have broad agreement that we've got to have a secure border, and we need to get the bad guys out of our country and people that are breaking the law. But you - if an employer is sponsoring someone and they're not on government assistance or welfare, they're chasing the American dream and paying taxes and contributing to the Oklahoma economy, we should encourage that. And so, I think that's one of the issues.
The other thing that has broad agreement among the governors is permitting reform. The federal government is way too slow. In Oklahoma, for example, pipelines are really, really important for us. And when you think about other states killing pipelines or the feds killing pipelines or taking eight years or all the cost of litigation, there's a problem. I mean, the CEO of Williams told me that it costs them twice as much to permit a pipeline as it does to actually build it. And that is that seems just unbelievable bureaucracy right now. Can you imagine saving all your money to build your dream home and we're gonna build a $500,000 dream home, and it costs us a million dollars just to do the permits? That's what we're dealing with. So, it's not common sense for things to cost twice as much on the paperwork side it is to build it. And so those are things that just gotten away from us and there's broad agreement with governors from both sides of the aisle to fix that.
Dick Pryor: Governor, states compete against each other for business development and economic expansion opportunities. So, what kinds of businesses is Oklahoma best positioned to attract today?
Governor Kevin Stitt: I would say any business that uses a lot of electricity. Just being from Oklahoma, we take this for granted that our utility costs are some of the cheapest in the country, just historically, we're some of most affordable electricity in the country. In Germany they pay 45 cents a kilowatt hour and Oklahomans pay 14 cents. And we're about a third of what they are in California. So, we just take this for granted, but that is a huge issue. And if you think about the reason we recruited the huge new smelter that's coming to Oklahoma and eastern Oklahoma, it's a $6 billion investment. It's because of our energy costs and because we're a net exporter. So, we have factories, we've got data centers, we've got anything that's using electricity is really important.
And then also labor. There's an advantage right now versus other states on cost of living, quality of life. So, we're seeing a lot of people move to Oklahoma just because of those issues as well.
So, you could talk about, you know, some of the things we naturally have clusters on is aviation, defense, that's continuing to grow in our state because of Tinker and because of kind of where we're at in the U.S. and the FAA Center. But unmanned aircraft, all kinds of stuff, are things that people are looking at Oklahoma from around the country.
Shawn Ashley: As you mentioned earlier, you're in your final year in office and about to begin your last regular session as governor. Now, I guess it's possible you might call a special sometime, (Stitt laughs) but the last regular session. In terms of your priorities, what unfinished business do you have left to accomplish?
Governor Kevin Stitt: Thank you for planting that seed that I can do a special session. Don't tell the legislature, they may not want that. But no, we'll have a great session this year. And what I tell Oklahomans is I'm always gonna focus on these four things. And I think it cuts through politics. I think whether you're Republican or Democrat, or you live in rural Oklahoma, or you live in the big city of Tulsa or Oklahoma City, we really all want the same things. The first thing is we want the best education for our kids. We want the opportunity for that next generation to thrive. So, we believe, and you've probably seen some of my executive orders - I'm doing this one today and it's on education freedom and more choice for parents and more options for apprenticeships and internships. This idea that we want our kids to be able to chase their American dream right here in Oklahoma. So, education is something I'm always going to focus on.
Business friendly. I come from the business world and Oklahomans know that I'm going to be fiscally conservative and I'm gonna be pro-business. And I believe that's the best way to govern and that's who we should look for as our governor is someone who comes from the private sector who understands business. Because we have the largest savings account now. We've had a great seven years so far, and we haven't had the fighting and the budget problems that were plaguing us before I got here. So being pro-business, making sure Oklahoma's set up for success there, and I'll be promoting a couple of those things.
Healthcare is something that I'm gonna tackle. Medicaid is out of control. It's unsustainable having 25% of our population on free healthcare. So, I'm gonna challenge, I'm going to do some things and some reform there. I did an executive order on Medicaid Advantage on Friday.
And then I think infrastructure is something that I always focus on. I think that's a core part of government is making sure that we are successful there. And I think Oklahomans saw how successful we were dealing with this winter storm. And had 600 trucks pre-treating the roads and we've got great infrastructure. So, I'll continue to kind of talk about that.
Welfare reform. I did an executive order yesterday talking about some programs that we need to audit. We need to make sure that we're using taxpayer dollars wisely, whether it's SNAP benefits or TANF or WIC or some of the some of the other programs across the state. So, it's going to continue to be my business-friendly theme and also promoting education, health care, and infrastructure.
Dick Pryor: More than 5,000 bills and joint resolutions are before legislators heading into the session. Last year, you let more than 300 bills become law without your signature. And in May, you said you would sign the things that would move the needle for Oklahomans. How do you determine what moves the needle?
Governor Kevin Stitt: It’s a great question. And I also probably vetoed 70 bills, I think, last year. Oklahomans know me. If it's going to cost the taxpayer money or it's not pro-business, I'm not going to do it. But that's a great question there because there's 5,000 new ideas, right? Well, me and most Oklahomans are like, “how in the world can we have 5,000 things every year to saddle Oklahomans with more problems?” Like, there's some states that do legislature every other year. Why do we need 5,000 new rules or laws in the state of Oklahoma? You know, there’s all these good ideas, but this all, most of the time, costs money. And I'm just a limited government guy, a guy that thinks government should get out of the way and allow the innovation and the free markets and the entrepreneurial spirit of Oklahomans to win the day. And not put saddle, you know, Oklahomans with more regulation or rules or good ideas. Government programs rarely solve societal problems. That's why I've got a faith-based initiative program. I encourage the churches to get involved and the nonprofits. I've gotta “be a neighbor” initiative where I bring people together. And I just don't think government's the answer.
Shawn Ashley: You've been at this job for more than seven years now. As governor, what do you worry about? What keeps you up at night?
Governor Kevin Stitt: Well, I sleep pretty good at night. When you first got elected - I'd never been in office before - and so everything was fast pitches and everything was coming at me. And I'm learning everything. Now, seven years in going to my eighth year, pretty much slow pitches. I know what I'm doing now. But the thing that keeps you up at night or worries you is, you know, public safety, like things that I can't control. And I just pray every day for the protection of my state. And, uh, but yeah, the things that concern me are more on the public safety side and, you know, making sure Oklahoma's, uh you know safe and, and, and our kids are safe.
And so those are the things that worried me the most. The other stuff you can deal with. A bill here. Do I like it? Do I not like it? But you know back to Dick's question there. If it's not gonna move the needle or it's not gonna be good, or it's just, you know, they're renaming a road or something like that, I just let that stuff go into law. I'm not gonna, you know, put my signature on it if it's not something that I think is good for Oklahoma.
Dick Pryor: Governor, in 2024 you said you did not accept being called a lame duck. You also said you are the most prepared you've ever been, and you just said that as well. Coming from the business sector, what have you learned about governance?
Governor Kevin Stitt: Oh man. Well, I've learned it's complicated and there's a lot of different opinions. And if you think about it, you've got all the different special interest groups, and you got all of the people that surround the Capitol. And I always tell Oklahomans, it's a 10,000 person inside baseball game that even knows what's happening here. Three point-nine-nine million Oklahomans out there are just taking their kids to piano lessons, soccer practice, going to work, heating their homes, their businesses. And they don't really know too much about the inside baseball game that's going up here. And I also say the money is always on the yes side. If you think about those 5,000 bills that are filed or something that's happening around those, that's not the legislature saying, hey, this is a good idea. This is an industry coming to them saying run this piece of legislation. And the money is always on yes side.
For example, I vetoed a pension increase for police. They already got 70 - municipal police officers - got 75% of their ending salary and retirement for life. That was a lot of money. And there was a bill that increased that to 90%. Alright? Who stands up for the taxpayer to say, hey, let's vote no on that? Because nobody goes and hires lobbyists to say vote no. The money's on the yes side. The money is always on the people that are gonna benefit from that extra taxpayer resource basically. S, you have to be smart about this and you have the elect people that are focused on protecting the taxpayer. We love our police, our law enforcement. But now you're gonna have a situation where teachers don't get 90%. So, they're gonna be coming after it. Firefighters don't 90%. Public employees, all the different unions are gonna come saying, “hey, we want now 90% of our ending salary in retirement.” Well, that's a lot of money. And eventually that kind of stuff bankrupts Oklahoma or bankrupts the U.S.
Shawn Ashley: There have been reports that ICE is considering locating detention centers in Oklahoma - Oklahoma City and Durant. What is your position on that? And what will you tell the federal government?
Governor Kevin Stitt: Yeah, well, first off, nobody's contacted me on those facilities. I don't know about that. I have heard like you have that they're planning on opening that up. And here's the deal. I think there's broad agreement that we need to remove the bad guys from our state. If there's somebody here illegally, there's a violent criminal…Oklahoma, I set up Operation Guardian and I took all of our prison population currently, and I turned that over to ICE. So, Oklahoma is leading the way in that. But you might've seen me nationally also speak out to say, “what is the end game?” Because I don't think the endgame is to deport every single non-U.S. citizen in the U.S. I don't think that's what Americans want because we're overthinking this immigration issue. I really believe that.
Other countries have figured this out that the states need to control workforce permits. In other words, if I have an employer that is vouching for an employee, I need to match them up. Let's not give them a U.S. Citizenship, but let's match up. If you're gonna chase the American dream, if you're going to contribute to Oklahoma's economy, if the employer is vouching for you and you're not on welfare or government assistance or Medicaid, why don't we want that, right?
And so, I think we're over politicizing this right now. And I think it's up to the president. And I'm excited that the president is actually taking some moves now to really re-question what is the end game there? We see it all in the news in Minneapolis. But the president has a tough job because Minnesota is not turning over their violent criminals in their prisons. And they're not doing the things that Oklahoma is doing. So, we need to push and make sure that we can all sit down and talk and figure this out. But Oklahomans and Americans don't like seeing people get killed or protesters and we have, you know, we're a very independent country and we have the right. We don't like feds in our states. And I think that's something that we're all having to wrestle with. What is the end game?
Dick Pryor: Monday's State of the State address will be your last as governor. What can we expect to be the focus of your speech?
Governor Kevin Stitt: Hopefully it's a good one. Hopefully you guys like it, but it's gonna be, you know, kind of common-sense reforms, make government more efficient, protecting our legacy. When I first, my first address, and during the campaign, I promised Oklahomans, I said, “hey, we need to have a $2 billion savings account.” And you can go back and look at the articles, but The Oklahoman and different folks made fun of me. There's no way, because we had zero money in savings. And in my peak, we had $5.5 billion in savings because Oklahomans elected a businessman governor. So, we're gonna be focused on protecting the legacy, setting Oklahoma up for success, not only my year eight, but also for the next eight years as well. And so, we're going to be prophetic with some things and some cautions and trying to secure our legacy and letting Oklahomans know how far we've come. And let's not go back to where we were.
Dick Pryor: As always, Governor Kevin Stitt, thank you for your time.
Governor Kevin Stitt: Absolutely, thanks for having me on and it's always great to talk to Oklahomans.
Dick Pryor: Looking forward to hearing your State of the State address on Monday. We will air it live on KGOU beginning at 12:30. That's Governor Kevin Stitt's final State of State address this Monday. For more information go to quorumcall.online. You can find video of Capitol Insider segments on the KGOU You Tube channel. Audio and transcripts are at kgou.org and look for Capitol Insider where you get podcasts. Until next time, with Shawn Ashley, I'm Dick Pryor.
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